Flexibility and growth

[Beauty]

Hi,

I apologize that in my long post I made you think that I was saying boundaries are bad for everyone. I was referring to my own personal feeling about them and what I can not accept because of who I am. I must admit who I am is not a perfect person. I'm really sorry if came off sounding like I was saying my way is the best. I was just saying that when it comes to boundaries with me, I can not live with them around who I am. I did try my best to say in my post that I didn't disagree with anyone else or think my way was the right way.

I promise I did not mean other boundaries aren't acceptable. I was referring to me. I really don't want to be defensive about what I typed, but it's kind of hard not to. At least I guess so, since my words are coming off in a defensive way.

I guess part of the reason I feel this way is because I opened my life up for everyone to see my problems, vulnerabilities and weaknesses and it seems as if I unleashed something about boundaries that was never my intention.

Sorry for the miscommunication.

Beauty

[GalicianGirl(SO)]

Beauty, there is no reason to be defensive about what you said...I understand that you were talking about yourself. If you don't need boundries that's great but I couldn't be that way. We are all different and what one person can tolerate another would say "no way".

Sharon(SO)

[CJ]

Hi all,

Beauty,

I totally agree with Sharon. No need to feel defensive. This is what I was hoping this little area would turn into; a place where we feel safe enough to be "real" with each other without fear of a backlash. Even Sinjoy's views (much of which I find myself in agreement with) are offered up in a loving and tolerant manner.

Of course, as a person whose gender variance is in his blood and bones, I found myself nodding in agreement throughout much of your own post as well. This is exactly why I started this thread. I'm wondering if any couple out there has come up with strategies where both CD and SO feel they can be who they are (and continue to grow) and, if so, what these strategies might be. I look at Curly and Ed's gentle circling around the issue, at first, and then at the benign way in which Ed's CD'ing became part of their life (to whatever extent) and I'm left wondering what the ingredient in their relationship is that made this possible. Is it unconditional love? Hyper-tolerance on Curly's part? Ed's mellowness? Eleven secret herbs and spices? What?

Beauty,

You've seen and heard me pretty much as I am last Sunday when we talked each other silly on the phone. I feel privileged to have been afforded this glimpse of who you are, as a person. You're a beautiful person, you really are. And, now, I see this glimpse echoed here. Here, on the forum, we more often see "Beauty the Moderator" than we do "Beauty the oh! so human person." Don't hide yourself from us, Beauty. Please. I want to know who you are, what you think, what you feel. I want to know this of Sinjoy, Curly, Sharon, and anyone else, here, too. I know there's often this weird thing where, looking back, we sometimes cringe when we think we've revealed too much about ourselves. Still, in these important matters, I'm not really sure there's such a thing as too much self-revelation. It goes with being real. You've called me on my defensive "tactics" a few times and I'm truly grateful for it. I truly am. It's kept me honest. With myself and with others. So, please, let everything stand as is, and don't fear the way this dialog wants to flow.

Love,
CJ

[Sinjoy(SO)]

Dear Beauty,

If my last post in any way upset you, I am SOOOO SORRY!!!

It was not a reflection of what you posted at all. I had thought about what I had wanted to write way before your post. I didn't feel that you were preaching or anything of the sort. You were just expressing you opinions, feelings and beliefs. The same as the rest of had, and you fully explained that these were just your thoughts. I don't think anyone could have precieved it any other way.

Again, I am really, really, REALLY sorry, if my last post upset you in any way!

Yours with love,

Sinjoy(so)

[Beauty]

Hi there,

No. Your post didn't upset me at all, honest. I was the one who was worried I'd not done a good enough job saying, "for me", but Sharon said it came off ok.

Sorry about not saying it wasn't you or Sharon. I was being defensive and I knew it wasn't good, but I just kept typing.

Beauty

[Curly(SO)]

I'm wondering if any couple out there has come up with strategies where both CD and SO feel they can be who they are (and continue to grow) and, if so, what these strategies might be. I look at Curly and Ed's gentle circling around the issue, at first, and then at the benign way in which Ed's CD'ing became part of their life (to whatever extent) and I'm left wondering what the ingredient in their relationship is that made this possible. Is it unconditional love? Hyper-tolerance on Curly's part? Ed's mellowness? Eleven secret herbs and spices? What?

CJ, I have been pondering this for a while, why did Ed and I not have any real serious problems with introducing CDing into our relationship? I think it was because I had no negative views on CDing in the first place. My only knowledge of CDing previously, had come from seeing a couple of interviews with Eddie Izzard, promoting CDing in a positive light. Also, maybe 20 years ago, there was a lot of publicity surrounding a local, married CDer, who worked on the trains in the town I lived. My memory is hazy over the actual events, but I think he was in the local papers because he was fighting for the right to wear female uniform while at work (I think he won the right). What struck me at the time was how his wife stood by him, I had a lot of admiration for her and her unconditional love.

I don't tolerate Ed's CDing, that would imply I dislike it, that is not how I feel. I can't exactly explain why the CDing doesn't bother me, it is just doesn't.

I would say that maybe we didn't circle too gently round the issue when Ed first told me. Ed's mellowness stemmed, I think, from embarrassment, he'd blurted it out, but was still very uncomfortable with me knowing. so what did we do? We talked! And talked and talked, you won't believe how much we talked it out over those first few weeks, even though at times I feel it must have been excruciating for him. We really did break down those walls of fear and embarrassment.

For me, it felt like I was getting to know Ed all over again. I told him that he suddenly felt like a stranger. I was worried the person I'd known up to that point was all just a lie, that hurt him, I know, but we had to drag everything into the open. I even got a skirt and sweater of mine out of my wardrobe, told Ed to put them on, then made love, that first evening he told me. Firstly, I think, I did that as a way of saying, it's OK, I accept you and secondly, I wanted to feel that he was still my 'man'.

Gradually, I came to see that Ed was still the same person as before, (he still farts, laughs and expects me to find it equally hilarious )he hadn't been portraying a lie, he'd just kept this extra dimension hidden from me. I wasn't angry or hurt that he'd lied, I could understand the reasons for keeping it hidden.

I think our biggest strategy for making this work (I checked with Ed about this) is, that we are able to laugh about it all (early days excepted, treading on eggshells prevailed as sensitive feelings were at stake!) I don't mean that I laugh at my hubby... we just do find amusement in everything, CDing being no exception.

I don't really have any answers, I just know how things are for us, but I do know that talking about it is the only way forward

Love,
Curly(SO)

[CJ]

Hi all,

Curly,

Awesome post! Thanks so much. Yes, isn't it just grand how even a small dose of good humour can take us a long way? Thanks for sharing this.

Love,
CJ

[Kersten Lee]

Hi,

I read all these tonight. I had to cry a little. It is the first time in a while. What has happened here is what all of you did for me. There are not answers for everything but by honest sharing we all can learn and strive to do better.

I have been torn by the problems with Sharon and Shannon and then I read such serious sharing, by who, but my perfect Beauty. Even darling Beauty whose happiness and strength has helped keep me afloat had been hurt herself. I was able to share such intimate details with all of you and yet I was unable to do the same with my dear wife of 30 years. It really is no wonder that she had emotionally separated herself from me and in turn I began to give up on her. So very similar to Beauty's story of desparation.

My wife had a knee joint replaced three weeks ago. I told my therapist this may be my last chance to save my marriage. I was afraid even with all I had worked at and all my promises here that I would not be able to be the supportive husband that I wanted to be.

I did very good! My wife has been opening up to me slowly and hopefully we can build on this to tackle some of the more difficult problems between us. My cross-dressing for us was an easy way to blame her for things about which I was not happy and she easily used the same against me.

For our 30 year anniversery my wife gave me a flower print skirt and a blouse top. That is a miracle. Things aren't yet great but if we can maintain our williness to talk about the serious issues, life could become the joy for the both of us that it should be.

There are never guarantees, but faith and hard work can go a long way!

Kersten