hi - *LOCKED*

[JenniferMu.(GG)]

I don't suppose anyone's really interested but everything sort of fell apart here. Mum and my sis have moved back to Grans place and after my Dad said it was mostly all my fault and he really got stuck into me and said he expected better from me after all he'd done for me and all the money he'd spent on me in my life, I just had to move away.

Well if he was putting a money value on our family then I didn't want any part of it so I dropped out of school and gathered up some things and I moved interstate. I've now got a job in the day in a supermarket and I'm waitressing at night so one day I can dump all his money back in front of him and then I'll owe him nothing.

I'm not too sure about this thing of men dressing up as women being such a wonderful thing as a lot of people say, as there seems to be so many people who are depressed and so many living in unhappy circumstances with it, but then I suppose as my father also says, I'm too young to have experienced much about life and what goes on, but I can say that this last 10 months or so has sure been one heck of a quick learning experience as I thought we had the lovingest, happiest and closest family on earth, but I can't change how I think in that I want my father as I've always known him, I've tried so hard but I just freak out when he's dressed like a woman, I feel sick in the stomach and mum and sis hate it too. Surely it can't be right that we have to accept how he feels but he doesn't have to accept how we feel, but anyway, I'm making a new life for myself and hopefully one day I'll still be able to fulfill my professional dream, but first I have to get out of his debt so he can never accuse me costing him a lot of money, that hurts.

Jennifer.

[Dixie Darling]

Hello Jennifer,

After reading most all the posts and replies, I may be too late in responding here since you've now begun to make preparations for your career. But on the chance that you just might read more on the forum, I'd like to comment on few of the things you mentioned. Hopefully I can offer you some encouragement As well as your mother and sister.

You said:
"I've never lived with what he's lived with, if that makes sense, so I find it impossible to try and understand how it is for him, but is there a way which we can understand more?"

My comment:
In my country, young men are often drafted for service in the military. Obviously it's for good reason - to defend our country against it's enemies. In times of war these young men are often required to do things that would be horrendous during peaceful times. Battlefields are terrible places where it might become necessary for a person to perform surgery
such as amputations or such in order to save a fellow soldier's life. It's also a place where many are required to take another person's life in battle. Someone who has never experienced such things on a personal level can only imagine what it might be like to carry memories of such action around with them every day. And yet, there are hundreds of veterans who must do that very thing. They didn't ASK to go to war. They were told what to do when they got there and failure to follow orders could very well have been considered treason and could have resulted in a lifetime in prison or death before a firing squad.

Crossdressing is somewhat similar in the respect that none of us volunteered to be crossdressers. We were BORN with it (See a brief explanation farther down in this reply) and, like those drafted into the military, we weren't given a choice.

You are a very wise young lady for your 19 years. The very fact that you RECOGNIZE that you've never had to live with what he's lived with (and for virtually all his LIFE too) tells me that you realize that you're dealing with something here that you aren't at all familiar with. I hesitate to use the words "uneducated about" or "ignorant of" because that sounds very harsh and doesn't extend the credit to you that you deserve. The fact is that you may have HEARD of crossdressers prior to discovering that your father was one, but you'd probably not had any reason to delve into just
what a crossdresser is and learn any of the details about us. The folks here in this forum have supplied you with a lot of information - GOOD information and directed you to some web sites (Thanks, DonnaT, for the referral) that they felt could help you and your family.

It's understandable that when viewed from the "outside looking in", crossdressing among males is a difficult thing to understand. Oddly enough, most crossdressers will tell you up front that THEY don't even understand it, so it's pretty much an impossibility for them to try to explain it to someone else. There is very little scientific research as to what the root cause of crossdressing is since it's a low priority item in today's world. Most medical authorities seem to agree that it's something that occurs pre-birth and as such, is something over which the person has no control or choice. The most plauiable theory (and mind you this is ONLY a theory, but it's the only one that makes good sense) is that of the
'hormone wash theory'. Basically what happens is that during a narrow 12 hour "window" at the end of the first trimester of pregnancy, the developing fetus (which at this point in time is neither male nor female) receives a massive 'wash' of hormones from the mother. These hormones determine almost all of the characteristics the child will have
when it is born. Hair and eye color, the propensity to be thin or obese later in life, whether the dominate hand will be right or left, and thousands of other characteristics. Think of it as somewhat like what happens when you turn the power on to your computer. Millions of instructions containing billions of bits of information are quickly "plugged in" to the proper places to make the computer do what it was designed to do. However, I know that at some point in time you've turned on your machine and had an error come up. That error was the result of something getting plugged into the wrong slot, or something not getting plugged in where it was supposed to be. What occurs during this "hormone wash" is very similar. Something got "wired wrong" somewhere. It wasn't your father's fault, nor his mother, nor his father. It's just something that happened and nothing that anyone is currently aware of could be done to stop it. However, once in place, this "wiring was made a permanent part of your father's personality.

You said:
"I hate how my life is right now and it used to be a ball. "

My comment:
From what I read in your posts, you have been fortunate to have good parents who have seen to it that you wee raised properly and have shown you how to enjoy life. That's commendable for BOTH of them and something that I hope you and your sister are grateful for and will reciprocate by raising your own children in a similar fashion in the future.
However, you are wise enough to recognize the fact that life isn't going to always be a ball. You will have times when you will feel like you're at the bottom looking up. What you're experiencing right now is one of those times when life ISN'T the ball that you'd like for it to be. But have good cheer - the sun will rise again tomorrow and there will come brighter days for you. God never intended for all of one's life to be miserable. At the same time He didn't intend for it to be a series of hardships and heartaches either. I think you have to experience the bad to be able to appreciate the good.


You said:
"What I worry about is that at the end of this year I will be going into an administration training management program for an international hotel chain for the next 5 years, so then I'll be away from home and may be sent anywhere in the world to gain experience and that worries me because it'll mean my 14 yr old sister will be left alone and she's always
had me to look after her and she's sort of scared of our father now because we both know that my best friends father has been touching my best friend for most of her life and my sister is now scared that our father may be the same, although he's never said or done anything out of place yet."

My comment:
Jennifer, if your read and understand anything at all in my reply other than what I'm about to say, be sure that you understand this. Just because your father is a crossdresser, that does not - by any stretch of the imagination - make him anything OTHER than simply a heterosexual crossdresser. The actions of your best friend's father are by no means
comparable to crossdressing. Neither is it permissible. THOSE are the kind of men that you SHOULD be afraid of and stay as far away from as is possible. This is the biggest misunderstanding about crossdressers. The typical crossdresser is not gay, he doesn't want to become a woman, he doesn't want to participate in any kind of sexual activities with other men (crossdressers or otherwise), he's not a child molester, he's not a wife beater. He's a common man who just happened to be born with the propensity to be a crossdresser. Just as a matter of information for you, the percentage of bi-sexual or gay crossdressers is actually less than it is for non-crossdressers in the general population.

You said:
"With my dad it's different because for the first 17 years of my life I've only ever known him as dad and the cool person he always was and he's always been my idea and vision of what a real dad is but now he's different. People can say that he's not any different it's only that I now know more about him but I can't see it that way as in my eyes he's no longer the dad he once was, he's now a different person."

My comment:
I know this is a repetition of what many of the forum members here have already told you, but it bears repeating. Your Dad is still the same person he was before you discovered he was a crossdresser. The ONLY difference now is that you are AWARE that he's a crossdresser. It might help to realize that this 'softer side' of your Dad's personality is directly responsible for a large part of his overall personality - a personality that you admit that you have loved all your life. Now imagine what it might be like if it were possible to take away that part of him. Would the resulting person be one that you would still admire? I seriously doubt that.

You said:
"The big problem is that when we do all sit down to try and talk about it then from his part of the conversation it's always 'I or me' it's never about 'us' or myself or my mother or sister although she doesn't ever talk about it with him she just can't she's scared of him now."

My comment:
I can assure you (and this is from what you've shared with us here about your life thus far) that your Dad IS concerned about you, your sister, and your Mom. Understand that he has been carrying around this secret all his life to keep it from hurting all of you. And in all probability he would STILL be keeping it a secret if he hadn't been discovered. Whether to tell, or NOT to tell is a big issue with most crossdressers since once the secret is revealed, there is never any way to take it back. It's an agonizing decision to tell, and one that many men cannot bring themselves to risk. Is that the right thing to do? That's something that's debatable. Do you take the risk and hope those who mean the most to you love you enough to at LEAST understand that this is a NEED that you have? Even though he doesn't understand why he has this need, he knows that it IS a need and that it is going to continue to demand his attention to be fulfilled. On the other hand, does he continue to try (key word here - TRY) to keep it to himself? Doing so could result in him living out his life without ever having been discovered - AND those in his life never having known that he lived in constant fear of discovery. It could also lead to something such as what's happened to you and the rest of your family. When he was discovered accidentally it invoked an air of distrust and suspicion. Although most crossdressers have nothing else that they are trying to hide OTHER than the crossdressing itself, the mere fact that they've been keeping THAT hidden causes others to think that if he was hiding that, just what else might he be keeping from us?

You said:
"We must have some rights too and just because he's our father and he earns lots of money so we can live good does that give him the right to have his way and we don't and we have to live everyday with something which we find hard to accept?"

My Comment:
Yes, you DO have rights. Since the secret is now out in the open in your household, you, as well as the rest of those who know, have a right to know all there is to know about it. You have a right NOT to see him dressed if it upsets you. You have a right to not have it rammed down your throat. And you have a right to voice your own opinions.

In Summation:
I see your grandmother as a very wise woman. She is apparently very aware of the fact that your father's crossdressing is something that he can't help. I can't tell you what to do and it's doubtful that I can change you opinions or that of any of your other family members. All I can do is speak to you in relation to what I've learned over the years about
crossdressing. I can ask that you love your father enough to continue researching it as you have so wisely done so far. It's obvious that he loves you and the rest of your family just as much now as he ever has, but he's extremely frustrated that he can't express to you anything that might help you to understand this NEED that you are now aware of that he has. If you continue to learn about it, then maybe -JUST MAYBE - you can learn to come to terms with it. I would bet you that he's still a great father, just as you've always viewed him, and that he's also still a great husband to your Mom too. Give it some time. As you grow older I think you'll learn that crossdressing is not the monster that you perceive it to be at the present.

My reply isn't meant to sound defensive. Nor was it meant to upset you. I sincerely hope that maybe I've said something here that will be of value to you.

Dixie Darling

[Beauty]

I don't suppose anyone's really interested but everything sort of fell apart here. Mum and my sis have moved back to Grans place and after my Dad said it was mostly all my fault and he really got stuck into me and said he expected better from me after all he'd done for me and all the money he'd spent on me in my life, I just had to move away.

Well if he was putting a money value on our family then I didn't want any part of it so I dropped out of school and gathered up some things and I moved interstate. I've now got a job in the day in a supermarket and I'm waitressing at night so one day I can dump all his money back in front of him and then I'll owe him nothing.

I'm not too sure about this thing of men dressing up as women being such a wonderful thing as a lot of people say, as there seems to be so many people who are depressed and so many living in unhappy circumstances with it, but then I suppose as my father also says, I'm too young to have experienced much about life and what goes on, but I can say that this last 10 months or so has sure been one heck of a quick learning experience as I thought we had the lovingest, happiest and closest family on earth, but I can't change how I think in that I want my father as I've always known him, I've tried so hard but I just freak out when he's dressed like a woman, I feel sick in the stomach and mum and sis hate it too. Surely it can't be right that we have to accept how he feels but he doesn't have to accept how we feel, but anyway, I'm making a new life for myself and hopefully one day I'll still be able to fulfill my professional dream, but first I have to get out of his debt so he can never accuse me costing him a lot of money, that hurts.

Jennifer.

Hi again,

We're always interested anytime you need us. Even if you don't understand us, you being here is a positive to me. I may never get your acceptance, but if you can understand us more that's ok. I may never get your understanding, but your acceptance is ok.

It sure sounds like the worst is happening. I'll go back to saying what I've said all along this is your father's fault. He's the one who kept the secret, he's the one who lived a lie. You were sucked into his vortex of deceit and twisted lies. How is that your fault? He gets to reap what he's sown. His distrust and denial cost him his family for now and maybe forever. Where did you grow up encouraging him this whole thing was a good idea? He's a big fat meanie for blaming you at all for your mom leaving (he's your father so that's as respectful as I could get). That's so freaggin messed up. I'd love to talk to him about that.

His lies caused his daughter and family to not understand him and loathe the site of him when he expresses a part of himself that he kept as a secret, not you.

He caused his oldest daughter to leave school because his lies bred distrust and angst in his family, not you. These lies and secrets he told and kept are the reason this is happening. I've finally lost quite a bit of respect for him (not all). I now see something I've been reluctant admit. In my prior posts I've been kind of saying, "well? maybe he is?" (him being a good father) Inside I've been thinking he's gotta be a good dad, look at you. Now I'm starting to give your mom and gran a lot more credit for raising you. Maybe the side you got from your dad is this rather bullish side. Maybe he's so upset at you because he doesn't like what he sees because it's himself in your reactions to this. (I doubt he literally sees it) Over life wise people have taught me that we often get disgusted with things quicker that other people do because they are the things we hate more about ourselves. It's been true for me.

I have to keep saying maybe because I'm not a professional nor am I qualified to know. I just really think both of you are pulling the family in opposite ways right now because you're both pretty head strong and most likely you're both pretty smart. That's still your dad's fault. If he doesn't lie and keep secrets to "protect himself" I mean the family? this wouldn't be happening. The true nature of a person comes out when they are faced with adversity. At your age that's just a good talking to. At his age, it's a bit of "shame on you (him)". He's totally handling this like a 20 year old who has the same responsibilities as an adult his age. He's supposed to be handling this like a person his age who has the same responsibilities.

You know I'm bummed about you leaving school, however I respect your decision for leaving right now. I just pray you listen to some good advice that many have given me, which is, "it gets harder and harder to go back every semester you miss and every year you age." So make it an active exercise to remember every semester you're missing. Don't worry about your friends that are getting ahead. At a certain point it all catches up if you get your education in the end.

I hope that was encouraging and not scary. Your life is scary enough right now for someone your age. I just want you to know from my own real life experience that as I got older it about killed me staying in school to get my degree. I did it but I got 3rd degree burns on my life because of it and started things later. I made chicken salad out of chicken shite, but it would have been much easier to have used the bonus of youth to be in college a lot sooner. If it weren't for God, there's no way I get my education, no way at all.

About the understanding us stuff. It's not a "wonderful" thing dressing up and wearing clothing. That's just us expressing ourselves. It's usually wonderful for us and not that enjoyable for anyone else. It's amazing that you're still listening to anything he says considering the way everything is going, but he's right about the age part and wrong about not admitting that you're right about the other side of CD'ing (the dark sides). Some people think CDing really just in their heads, some people don't have to express their femme side by dressing, some get a sexual hurray when they put on female clothing, some get depressed, some lie and deceive the one's they love most to protect themselves (though they say it's to save the family ), some lead a depressing life, which I believe you've read on the forum. The part your dad is right about is you don't have to be a CD'r to have that happen. You can apply that to housewives, firemen, politicians, soldiers, and even clergy. Your youth hasn't allowed you to experience this yet, but in time you will. You have enough to think about, ya know?

The last 10 months have kind of shown you what life is going to be, not what life can be like. Life is so freaggin' hard. Sometimes even the most faithful (which is what I aspire to be) have a hard time understanding why, but the years where tough decisions and odd things that happened (at the time they looked bad) years later have so much meaning that you go, "I still would have rather not gone through that, but at least I understand why I did now." That's been my experience and what I've noticed for others who don't quit.

You do have the most lovingest, happiest and closest family on earth. It's just that you father caused a temporary break up that could lead to a permanent break up. Your family dish is broken in to a lot of pieces, but it's still the same dish. If you put it back together it probably won't look the same, but it's still the same dish. I'm only saying that not to make a grand analogy, but to say, "Stop thinking that all your perceptions have been wrong" The only perceptions about your family that are wrong are the ones your father lead you astray on revolving around his secrecy. Ok and maybe the Santa Claus thing wasn't all him. Regardless, boy am I not happy with him. :insert conflagration:

Do I think when you're 100 years old you're going to go, "Why the heck did I care about that so much?" Yeah I do, but the problem there is you've got about another 80 years to go.

I know I've kind of said this before, but I still feel the dad and family that you thought you have now passed on. Now comes grief. The range of emotions that you're going through and the alteration of your life should all be experienced, in my opinion. (sorry I keep saying "in my opinion", but you're going to get a lot of excellent advice and it may be great advice that differs from mine) What I mean is do as you're doing now and don't suppress your feelings to keep a false peace. From my life experience getting it out served me far better than waiting for things to calm down. When they calmed down for everyone else I was still wound up. Then I was accused of stirring up a hornets nest again. Can't win, eh?

The super duper colossal difference between your situation and real life death is there hasn't been a loss of life here. A perception is dead, an idea is dead, not a person. With human death you sometimes can't get closure because the person you want to work things out with can't talk to you. You have the ability still to vent, cry to, express love and anger towards someone and get feedback.

Sheesh. ok. I've gone off the deep end. I said you have to be 100 years old to go, "What's the big deal?" After reading this long arse post you must be at least in your 70's now. How are things going? Sorry, I can't stop myself from cutting up even in super serious times. It's a personality flaw.

Your a terrific young lady, you're a great daughter, you're a loving human, and the more I get to correspond with you the more I gain respect for you.

As I said we're open 24/7. Please come here and talk to us when you need anything, you're not ever a bother.

Beauty

[Allena]

This is all very overwhelming.

Jennifer, I'm...I'm not sure where to start and I don't want to prattle on, as you put it a while back.

First off, I hope if you're still reading here, you'll see that there are folks here who ARE interested in what's happening to you.

I believe this interest is partly because probably everyone of us, crossdressers, wives, other family members, have been through pain over this issue.
Your pain and the pain you describe your family feeling really hits home for me.

I agree with Beauty in that your father did something very wrong by lying and hiding his need to crossdress.
I'm in ths same boat as is many other men here.
My wife is working with me to see how we can make the best possible outcome we can for us and our daughter of 11.

My daughter does not know, at least not directly from me or my wife.
I would like to tell her some of it now, but conventional wisdom says to wait until she is older.

Here I go yacking about MY life.
Sorry!

Psychology is not, should not, be about influening another person's mind.
I find that there are some very good reasons to search for answers by leaning more about human psychology.
The same goes for Philosophy!

I guess I'm wanting to say that as humans, we set ourselves up to handle situations in particular ways.
Since society in general sees Crossdressing as abhorant, something 'kinky' and/or perverse, this sets up the normal responses from parties on both sides of the issue.

You, your sister and your Mum seem perfectly in line with the average person if you say that friends that you've always known as Gay are no trouble for you to handle, but seeing your own father in women's clothing after 18/19 years of knowing him without that piece of the picture makes you want throw up.
I can also understand your sister's worries that your father might be hiding even worse tendencies.
I hope this is not true.
I believe that the worries of your sister will be found to be overblown.
Meaning, I believe that if your father had the impulse to sexually attack you or her, he would have done so before now.
I hope this is true.

You do not deserve, from what I've been reading, to be held accountable for your father's problems.
I'm am so sorrry he is unable to control his outbursts and unable to think things through at a more reasonable and critical level himself.

I'm SO glad you folks have your Grandmother to talk with and gain support from.
I hope you father can find someone like her also.

He needs to begin to understand several things here:
1) That if his desire to crossdress is something he feels he has to do, then it is normal for him and he should feel comfortable with that.
He should also be willing to accept all phases and feelings connected with this side of him. This relates in part to the sexual issue brought up earlier. He has to learn that if what he is doing is mentally and physically healthy for him...not harmful...then it is okay to aknowledge the fact that certain feelings and desires exist within him.

2) He is engaged in something that societies around the world frown upon.
I'm sure he knows this all too well. Crossdressers live with incredible pressure. We are constantly bombarded with the notion that a man who feels the need to experss himself in a feminine way, who has these urges to re-create himself in the persona of a woman, is outside if acceptable standards.
Take a look at how men in women's clothing are portrayed in our media;
in movies, on television, in print and on the internet.
Silence of The Lambs - Crossdresser is a psychopathic killer and body mutilator.
The Adventures of Priscilla; Queen of the Desert - Flambouyant, someone to be jeered at and laughed at.

On t.v. and in print, CD's are similarly portrayed as a joke, someone to pick on, or someone devious and evil.

So, with all that, I'm sure there's a reasonable desire for hiding the fact of his dressing. But he has to get beyond what other people generalize about and accept what he knows is real.

3) If he wants to stem the bleeding of the family wounds, he has to be a participant in that campaign. He has to quit attacking the family for things he has done to them and to himself.
He has to allow that the 'other parties' have a right to their feelings.
He may not like what he sees and hears from you all, but he cannot attempt to force you into silence and acceptance.

4) He has to realize he is probably not any stronger than any other human when it comes to these excrutiating issues. He needs to find someone who can listen impartially to him, mirror back what he is saying so he actually realizes what he's feeling and how he's reacting.
He can't go it alone, and the four of you most likely cannot work it out amongst yourselves without a neutral mediator.
There will be times when he needs to work on this alone, times when he needs to work on it with each of you individually, and times when he needs all of you to be together to discuss the issues.

You and you sister and Mom need to do similar things, though.

1) Accept your anger, confusion, fears, but do not let these become the main focus in your lives. The two issues here, crossdressing and deception, can be worked out to a level each person can accept...PROVIDING...each person can open up within themselves and deal with these two rationally.

2) Accept that there are two levels on which you relate with your father; as an individual, and as a family.
Allegiances are important. You sticking by your Mom's side is very important for her and you, your sister, and believe it or not...probably your father also.
If he holds the same feelings as so many CD men do, then he's probably feeling a good amount of guilt over the deception he's kept up all these years and the pain he's caused each of you. Knowing his mate, his wife has someone to help support her is probably a relief on one level to him.
BUT,
Remember the two levels...individual and group(family).
The relationship you have with your father now and later is controllable by you, ultimately. No matter what he says or does, no matter what anyone else says or does, you make the final decision as to how you'll live with this.
Take good care of yourself! They teach something to people who train to rescue others...if the rescuer doesn't take care of themselves first, then they may very well become another victim.
Before you can offer any real and substantial support for your family, you have to come to terms with your feelings and decide how you will live with all this. Only then can you be strong enough to help out others...including your father.

As a family, you all need to be respectful to each other. Your Grandmother has given you a fine example, please pay attention to her!
One of the biggest issues I've seen with family pain is when one person is given an ultimatum to stand on 'one side of the fence or the other'.
This is very destructive.
Each of you has to find your own place of peace here and then respect that in the others. Then as a family, you can provide the support necessary to help ease each other's pain, calm each other's frustrations...love each other.

3) Understand the depths of human emotion and how bizarre-seeming the human mind can be at times.
I mentioned that I thought your father probably felt guilt over this issue.
It sure doesn't look like it on the surface when he's yelling, and accusatory towards you.
But behind the veneer, each of us has the capacity to hold our true feelings in. No matter how much we want to let it out.
If there was a way to know why people act the way we do, we'd have no more crime...right?
Humans are very complex beings intellectually. Please keep this in mind.
This doesn't let someone off the hook for all of their behaviour, but it can help you to 'see it from their side' perhaps a bit easier.

Again, I really think that you all need to find someone who can mediate your discussions...and that means a professional. Someone who won't come into this with the belief that one person or the other is right or wrong, good or bad. They are there to listen critically to what each client is saying. You , your sister, mother and father have too much invested emotionally to always sit back and REALLY listen to what the other person is saying.
You noticed that I said 'always'? I certainly believe that each of you can, at times, have the ability to listen critically and not respond out of emotion, but I don't believe that currently anyone is ready to give it a go alone.

Can I summarize this up in less than 3,780 words?

I doubt it, but I'll try

You sound like an astute individual. While typing all of this, I kept fighting back tears. I hate to see families torn apart by issues like this.

Time will not heal all wounds, it just buries them.
Please don't bury your wounds.
Continue along the path you are on now. Your actions here are an incredible example of the strength we each have but do not always recognize nor utilize.

Just as you realize your emotions can be deep and complex, please keep in mind that your father and mother are the same way.
It is not YOUR job to make them whole. Not your job to keep the family together.
First and foremost you must provide for you own health...physical and mental.
Only then can you reach out to others with help knowing you are reaching from a strong base instead of a weak one.
From your description of the relationship with your sister, I get the sense that you may very well be setting an example for her to follow. Although she is an individual every bit as much as you are, how you take care of yourself and how you deal with this whole mess will likely influence her reactions also.

I wish I could do more, I wish I could do something more substantial than these words on your screen.

I hope my words are more helpful than not, too.

Take care and remember that you are welcome here!
Your Sister is welcome here!
Your Mother, Grandmother, and especially your Father are welcome here.

I would like to think that your Father could gain as much help as I have from the wonderful people who logon to this place.

Take care and may you fare well!

[JenniferMu.(GG)]

Gee whiz, there's just so much stuff been said I'm going to have to read and re-read it all many times as each time I read it all I see things which didn't dawn on me the time before and I thank you all from the bottom of my heart for the concern you've shown, it's hard to describe but it's sort of like being taken into another family, if that makes any sense. I'm just so tired and deflated at the moment as it's taking longer than I thought to get used to working days and evenings and it's not as easy as I thought it would be getting used to a complete change in my life. I miss my family so terribly but I have to get away by myself or I'd finish up in the nut house.

I don't want people to think that I hate my father because I love him to death. I love him so much that if his life depended on having a heart transplant then he could have mine in a flash, I wouldn't even have to think about it.

What people can't understand or they aren't willing to listen to me about, including him, is that what I want is my father back as I've always known him. People are wrong if they say he's still the same person he always was, that's just not possible.

All my life I've hugged and squeezed my father every day of my life and when I do it now he's not the same person. he doesn't even smell the same, he now smells like my mother does, he's lost that male smell, he now smells like a woman. He acts different and he dresses different and he talks different and he looks different. When I looked at him adjusting his bra shoulder strap under his suit coat it just made me freak. That's not my father as I know him, that's a different person. Why does a man wear a bra when he has no need to. We wear bras for a certain purpose because we need to and him doing things like that makes me believe that what he says is not true and he does it for more reasons than he's willing to own up to. My father now wears make up around the house, that's not my father, that's a different person from the man I grew up with and there's no way anyone can say he's still the same person. Maybe he's still the same to him, but to me he's not, I'm seeing someone I don't know and I want my father back. I think part of a person is our personality and his has changed, also part of a person is how we act and look and the things we do and he's changed in those too. Maybe his genes and that are still the same but other things have changed.

What has p'd me off more than anything is that he wants us to accept that he wants to go ahead in leaps and bounds now that it's out in the open with us but he's not willing to try and see that it's changed all our lives so much, and although we want him to be happy we want him to respect how we feel, and what I can't get into his thick head is that I just don't want to see him dressed as a woman. I might change how I think later on but now there's been so much going on in my life and I just couldn't give everything the attention it needed. I couldn't give my learning the time it needed and as people may know the last year is a demanding one. I had a lovely boy wanting my attention and it hurt me just as much as it did him when I rejected him because my studies were the most important thing in my life, then this all happened suddenly by accident and everything went out the toilet window.

If he could have put it all aside for a couple of years so there wasn't this big upheaval then maybe in a year or two when I completed by studies successfully things might have been different, but I'll never know now since it seems that he comes first before anyone else.

Allen, I keep seeing your words where you say you wish you could do more, well I can't begin to tell you that what you've written has moved me so much and given me so much to think about and I thank you from the bottom of my heart for the time you've taken with a stranger. Also Beauty, what can I say, you knock my feet out from under me and I don't want you to take this the wrong way, but when I read what you say to me it's like reading something which an Aunty has written to me, you're so wonderful, your wife is a very lucky lady to have you. Dixie, I thank you also for all the time you put into saying what you did to me and you've given me lots to think about too. The only thing I don't agree with you about is that my Dad is still the same person he was before I found him in Mums dress. He's changed in lots of ways and he doesn't even look like the Dad I knew before. I lay here some nights in my bed and think about the other week when I was gathering up my things to move away. I can still see my room where I grew up in. I can see my Dad sitting on my bed as I grew up, talking to me, tickling me, reading me stories and all that and it breaks my heart to then think about how he's now different and I want that man back, I don't want a foreign person who wears make up and a wig and a dress, who walks and talks different and just isn't the person I once knew. He can do all that out of my sight, I don't care how much he does it if that's what he has to do, but in my heart I know that I just can't stand it and it's changed all our lives so much, so that we had to be so careful who and when we had people come visit us, who before, all the time just dropped in on us unannounced.

What he blames me for and says is my fault is that because I won't give in to him it's made Mum and my sister unhappy and that if Iw as more accepting about it then they would be too. He says that I'm influencing them in how they're thinking about him and he says I should open my heart more and not be so cold about it, but then I can only do what I can do the same as it is for him. He blames me for Mum and my sis moving to Grans and he says if I hadn't gone then they wouldn't have either so I guess it's a never ending argument because if he kept his dressing up away from our sight as he did all my life then I wouldn't have moved out and neither would Mum. Gran told me a while back that he's used to getting his way as he's boss over a lot of people in his work and he's used to people doing as he says, even though he was never like that at home as I remember, gran says that now that it's out in the open with us his authority streak is taking over as he's kept his private life hidden for so long now that it's out in the open he's having trouble keeping it all in check, and I suppose it makes sense, but then Gran knows most things about most things.

I really don't know where it all goes from here. I don't know if it'll take a month or a year or ten years for any answers to come. I just know I had to get away by myself where I could cry it all out by myself and that's done now, there aren't many tears left and I guess the next step one day will be to let them know where I am, I just didn't want anyone landing on my doorstep until I got rid of what was inside me. The only person who knows where I am is my best friend and I had to let her know so that if anything happened she would know where I am. She's the person who we've both been able to tell things to each other all our life which we wouldn't ever tell to anyone else and when I was packing up my things to move I had such a strong feeling that I wanted to set fire to that room and burn all the memories which everything in there brought to me, but I thought of all the things we'd talked about together locked away in that room since we were very small and those I couldn't ever destroy. I hope I never get that low again as anyone who has sunk down there knows it's a scarey place to be.

I wanted to ask something, as all you men and women know more about life than I do. Lets say something suddenly bobs up which you're not used to in your life, like my fathers case. Do you think something like that would be more easy to accept if it were a cousin or an uncle or an aunt or whoever, other than your closest blood relative or your husband or wife. What I'm trying to figure out is, is it possible that if it were some relative more removed than my father is it normal that the feeling and reaction would be different. I mean I know gay boys and I consider them good friends, but that's all they are to me, just friends. I've had them in my home and I've taken them to Grans and everyone knows they're gay and we all think nothing of it, so why in the hell has this damn thing with my father torn us all so much apart. It freaks me out to see him dressed as a woman but on the other hand I've thought it cute when I see one my gay friends wearing girls garments, maybe it's me who has the out of tune wacky brain, but how do I make it different because I still want my father back when I see him more than ever as he always was and if that's asking too much then so be it. I guess I have to either get over it or suffer with it, beacuse you all say that's how he is and he can't change, but I still think he should be able to control when and where he does it or he's been telling lies for years when he's told us how much we mean to him. I've told little lies in my life too, but nothing as big as when I say how much I love someone and what I'd do for them if I had to.

Jennifer

[Beauty]

Hi there,

Hmmm Here's my attempt to answer your question. I guess it depends? If they are bible thumpers it's most likely they'll freak. They'll try to get the person to repent. I don't think it would hit the "thumpers" as hard as it would a close relative, but I think it could hurt, shock, or depress them just as much. For the most part you never really know a CD'r when you pass them in the hallway. We TG'd people have a better radar (your ability to see them will get better too), but usually people miss them. So I think the family members would be in shock because they most likely never saw it coming, they never saw this person as anything but a man.

As far as friends go, I think it's just more of a moral question for them. Even super close friends who take an "anti-gender changing moral code" stance tend to turn their backs on TG'd folks because they think "men are men and that's that", or it's evil, or worse. The other thing is if a friend has children they could think, "Perv!!!!" and they'd want to instinctively protect their family and distance themselves because of that. Otherwise it's no skin off their back and it should be easy for them to accept a friend or distant relative if they were friends. That's my insignificant opinion.

Jennifer can I change gears like from 4th down to reverse? I so hate saying this because I know you know it all ready and because I want to give you what you want so badly, but baby doll you can't have your dad back the way you want him back. :my heart just broke saying that : If I've been reading everything right, you don't even want that dad back because he wasn't being honest with you. To say you want that dad back is saying (underneath the covers) you want the deception to continue although on the surface you're saying, "No.. I just want the memories and feeling I had when I'd see him as the masculine father I knew him as. I don't want the deceit." You can't have him back regardless, but even if he threw everything away, you'd start hugging him again and you'd feel how empty he was. He wouldn't be happy and you'd sense it and feel it. Then you'd feel guilty because now he'd be miserable and you'd have a world back that was just as artificial as it was prior to him telling. I totally relate with why you want things back to the way they were because of circumstances in my life where you and I are alike about that wish. I don't think there's anything wrong with you feeling that way or if you even keep saying it, but please allow your mind to progress to what that would mean. Like would you really want to wake up see your dad as a Ken doll? A plastic smile, but no soul? From everything I've read I'd say your answer would be, "No." If you already do that I so apologize about my banter.

Ok, on to another gear. What does 2nd gear do? Let's try. You've said a few things about him that make me go, "Hmmm?" Do you think he's a transsexual? I mean men wear femme clothing under their clothing all the time, so it doesn't mean he is a TS nor do I mean to imply he is, I'm really just asking what you think. Has he been clear about CD'r only? Have you asked him if he wants to become a woman?

He may not and here's a little bit about me. When I came out to my wife, really came out, I was very selfish for a bit. Buying new things, being really attentive to my other gender and more stuff because it was freaggin' out. I was sooo tired of repressing my feelings I forgot about others for a bit. I'd been thinking about others all my life. So it could be that he's just going through that phase. Some people don't stop there because they really decide the CD'ing isn't enough. That's why you hear a joke that goes, "What's the difference between a CD'r and a TS? About X months/years." The X varies in the joke as does months/years. The joke is kind of playing on a bit of truth. Sometimes when someone comes out about being a CD'r and they say, "I'm only dressing" there's more to it, but they don't know it yet. They've kept their feelings repressed for so long they don't know how deep this thing goes and then they, in the end, transition to the opposite sex. That's not the norm though. Those stories just make "Good television" so they are reported more.

Ok, back to 4th gear now. Let me just tell you one other thing about my feelings about your dad. I've beaten the heck out of how p'd I am about him blaming you and for keeping the secret for so long, but I can empathize with how he did it. I don't dislike him. I don't hate him. I feel bad for him, but not as bad as I feel for you because you didn't have a choice. I caught myself from digressing. I have an uber close friend who did the same thing your dad did (didn't tell anyone) and she's now divorced and her kids are pretty upset, but much less than before. She also now will dress in a way that makes her children feel comfy instead of imposing her will upon them. That wasn't always the case either. I love and respect her so much as my friend and I patiently waited as she went through changes that I had also gone through. I would be a huge hypocrite about this if I told you I dislike your father when I understand why and what my friend went through. The only thing she didn't do was blame her child for what was happening. That's my bitter point with your dad. :biting tongue so I don't repeat what I've said like ten times already : Anyway, my heart honestly goes out to your father, but you, your mom, and your sister come first because I've gotten to know you better. That doesn't change the fact that I feel for him. I wish he'd talk to someone, but like you, he's a bit strong in the mind and for now he's doing self therapy. That should change. The "coming out" euphoria is soon going to subside. Trust me, it happens to us all. Life is longer than the high of finally not having to hide a secret about who you are. He'll discover that in the coming months. I just wanted to set the record straight. I think you knew already I did not dislike him, but I decided to chime in, in case I was very wrong.

Lastly. Why would I be offended by you saying I write like an Aunty? You made my day.

You're the best Jennifer, we know it and so does your awesome family. Be just as strong as you have been. I'm amazed by how strong you are. You're going to make an awesome spouse one day!

Beauty

[Allena]

Jennifer,

First I'd like to apologize for my poor spelling in the previous post.
I read it again and I couldn't believe how bad it was.

Anyway,
Hmmm, where to start?
Your father!
One of the things I think I've learned about behaviors like crossdressing, is that they tend to get repressed alot. When there's a crack in the closet door, it's hard to keep everything from exploding out into the room.
Basically, once the secret was out, perhaps your father fell to a not-so-uncommon reaction of feeling like he had finally found FREEDOM!

I know that after I told my wife about my crossdressing, I succumbed to several new trains of thought;
I was SO relieved that I didn't "have to" lie about it anymore. And I mean lying to everyone in my life, not just my wife! Now, I didn't rush out and tell anyone else, but I certainly imagined that I could.
That was fantasy number one!

Fantasy number two was the feeling that since my wife didn't kick me out of the house that night, that perhaps there was some level of acceptance for my behavior.
I started imagining that I would be able to convince her that everything was alright and that she could actually enjoy having me dress as a woman around the house. Hey! She'd have a new 'girlfriend', a confidant who wasn't some obnoxious male!

I hope you see where I'm going with this. Basically, my overwhelming sense of guilt, shame, combined with relief, led me into a period of delusion.
I realized that although the secret was out now, I also stood to lose everyone and everything I held so dear.
It was breaking my heart.

On top of that, I also felt overwhelming guilt for the pain I imagined I was putting my wife through. My self-esteem was already low, but I found a way to push it even lower.

It took me a while to understand how wrong my actions were.
I have since, purged yet again and worked really hard at 'quitting', which made me even more unhappy than before.

I started to resent how my wife, 'couldn't just think this through logically and realize that I was not hurting anyone!'.
I have had to learn how wrong I was about that.

You see? There are many complicated factors involved in this for the crossdresser.

After hiding this part of him for so long and dealing with the conflicting personalities of being a 'strong man' in one world, and a 'terrible person' in the other, I imagine it's easy for your father to blindly focus on himself only.

Perhaps he's still struggling about whether he's a good person or a bad person. Perhaps he's struggling with the fact that he realizes the people who are the closest to him, the ones he loves more than any others, seem unable to accept him as his is...he's doomed to be hated, despised, shunned by his own family.

Now, Jennifer, I want you to know that what I've been saying is not meant to be seen as taking his side.
I'm just trying to relay the types of thoughts and feelings that a crossdresser is likely to have.

I do hope in time he can learn to quiet down and listen to you. You need him to hear what you say. You need him to understand how you feel.

As far as your feelings about who he is now to you, I cannot imagine a more difficult idea to try and relate to someone.

I wholly accept your notion that your father is no longer the man you knew before this all happened.
Your relationship with your parents is so vastly different from any other family member.

You have lived your life with an image ingrained in your psyche of who your father was.
Your personality was partly molded by this image of your father.
Part of who you are is permanently linked with the 'old' Dad.
What you discovered recently was something that threatened the validity of all the above.
It realy tears me up to think of the horror, the pain and confusion you must have gone through. Partly because I'm human, and I have given your posts my acknowledgement as to their validity and so I have opened my heart to this story.
Partly because I have an 11y.o. daughter whom I'm very afraid of hurting and alienating someday just like this.

Because of the way society views crossdressing, your reaction is certainly normal.
I think so anyway!

To a crossdresser, homosexual, transsexual, and others, it's painful to realize that you are always going to be marginalized.
It's painful to realize you might incure the rath of not only individuals, but institutions and governments also.
Your neighbors, your family and friends, your church, your child's school, the grocer down the street...everyone in your life is a potential source of pain for you if your secret gets out. The pain can be manifested in many different ways depending on who it is you're dealing with.

You realize you'll be ostracized.
You realize you will be demonized.
You fear you will be attacked verbally and/or physically.
You fear the loss of so many things you hold dear.

I know those feelings all too well.

I have learned, through my wife though, that she knows these feelings all too well herself.

It's a terrible thing we've done to ourselves in this world.

Because of this, the crossdresser tears away at his self-image.
Oh sure, he may prop up the old veneer and put on a good show outwardly. He's THE MAN, he's a good worker, a go-getter, a tough-guy, a dictator.
What people don't get to see is his weakness.
He may try to resist those 'urges', but they get the best of him eventually.
Depression might set in and he may start to really question his manliness.
"I guess I really must be ______" (gay, a pervert, sick, the devil, etc. ).
With that comes the trips into the dark places of our society.
This doesn't happen to everyone, but it's not at all uncommon.

If he can regain his senses, he'll throw himself into a fit of guilt.
He'll decry the horrid behavior and vow never to do it again.
He'll purge himself of the desire, he'll purge his home of the offending garments.
He'll go along like this until his true self starts calling out again.
The more this cycle continues, the more he paints what should be a normal part of his 'self' as a dark, demonistic curse.

Can you tell I'm spilling my guts here?

Sorry...AGAIN...!

The family member(s) don't know what to make of this person before them.
It may be similar to being an adoptee who never knew. ( I've always known )
For many years of their life, the adoptee knew who their parents were, who their family was.
Then one day someone tells them they were adopted.
Sorry! You no longer have that beautiful Mom, that beautiful Dad, that beautiful family!
"If I'm not this person...then who the hell am I?"
"If I can't believe what they told me all my life, who can I believe?"
And so on.
The disruption of your personal foundation is nothing to take lightly.
This is not something you go get a book for and read all about how to 'fix it'.
You were never prepared to handle an identity issue so personal as this!
"Can't he just stop doing it?", they ask.
"If he kept it hidden for so long, why bring it out NOW?"
"If he really cared about me/us, then he'd just ______ !"

All the hurt, frustration and confusion, with none of the answers.

Both sides hurt.
Both sides feel guilt of some sort over something here.
Both sides desperately wish for everything to 'go back like it was', even though they know it can't be that way anymore.

What isn't seen.
What isn't available yet...is the proverbial 'light at the end of the tunnel'.
But that light will come!
And when each of you walk out into it, you will hopefully see not only how different life is then but how far you can go with your lives.

Stay strong Jennifer.
Don't isolate yourself.
You need your time alone, I understand that.
Just don't close the doors behind you.
Keep them open just a crack, so when you hear them calling you...when you heart forces you to turn and run back to those you love...
you won't smack your forehead into the door and fall flat on your butt
Sorry, I had to brighten things up just a little

Sounds like you know the family love is still there.
I hope it always is.

Take good care Jennifer!

[Loretta Ann]

Hi Jennifer,

For some reason I lost track of this thread. Not exactly sure why, but I will jump back in here with both feet.

I don’t think advice comes any better than what others have given you here. I just want to elaborate a little on something Beauty said.

And that is that you can’t have your father back the way you had him. And you should not want to have that person back. You need to grieve that lose even if the picture that you have of your father (the way he used to be) was a false picture, it was still your picture and therefore very real to you. That needs to be dealt with.

Once that has been done you will likely move on to wanting a better relationship (a different relationship) you should become unwilling to accept any thing less than that.

This crap is not easy to go through. I know from personal experience. It is extremely painful to be forced to go through something like this.

I just want to encourage you here by telling you that there is life after this for you. The sun will shine on you again some day. And once you get through it you might even be able to look back on it as something you would not have wanted to miss out on, even though you would not have agreed to go through this if you had been given a choice.

Oh! and one other thing; in terms of paying your father back you don’t owe him anything. Please do not accept the guilt trip, and don’t let him control you like that? You are/will have suffered enough as a result of this. Please try and focus on your life from here on out? This is a new chapter for you.

His actions of trying to put the blame on you for what has happened, is nothing more than another attempt to control you through quilt. Please don’t buy into it? Please see it for what it is? If you can that will be your strength.

You are a remarkable young lady to have come here and share your problem with us. I commend you for it, and wish you well.

Love Darlene.

[Dixie Darling]

Jennifer,

As a follow up to my previous reply, and to comment on some of the things others have also mentioned. . . .

Somehow I missed the fact that your father is now parading around in his feminine persona with a kind of “in your face” attitude. I was under the impression that he was still keeping the visual side of his secret behind closed doors and apparently I was totally in error in my assumptions.

What he’s doing is WRONG if he’s under the impression that forcing himself on you and your family in this manner is going to make a positive difference, and if you happen to talk to him you can tell him that another crossdresser SAID so! It’s possible, since he is a manager at his place of employment, that he has the mistaken idea that he can take control of his family in much the same way he takes control of matters at work. It simply doesn’t work that way. His employees are motivated to do what he tells them to by the paycheck they receive for the work that they do. In a family situation, that motivation is generated by the love the family has for him for all the things he does for them. By doing what he’s doing right now he is, in effect, destroying that motivation.

While he (at the moment) is feeling a ‘freedom’ that he hasn’t previously had, it’s going to be short-lived and sooner or later he’s going to drift back down to earth and come to the realization that it’s way past time to initiate a lot of damage control actions. You, as his daughter, need to watch for and be prepared when this happens. At the same time, take the advice you’ve been given here and whatever else you may learn before that time into account and apply it to the situation in a wise manner. While it will be a time for a “day of reckoning”, it NOT a time to brow-beat your dad simply because you want to do so. Having read all your posts I have no doubt at all that you are a loving and caring daughter and you will apply that love in an appropriate manner.

Now, as far as you trying to earn enough money to repay your dad for all that he says he’s given you up to this point in your life – FORGET IT!!!! You don’t owe him anything (monetarily speaking). Just as he didn’t make a conscious and voluntary move to be a crossdresser, YOU didn’t volunteer to come into this world. It was a decision made mutually by your dad and your mom and as such you were their responsibility and therefore it was their charge to provide you with the necessities of life. So you owe him nothing other than your love and appreciation for all he’s done for you in your adolescent years. This isn’t meant to sound harsh so please don’t take it that way.

If your dad has internet access I would advise him to have a look at a few web sites that address crossdressing and the problems it can cause. Many of the members here (myself included) have personal web sites that are chocked full of useful advice for not only the crossdresser, but also for his family. You can find the links to these in other parts of this forum and it might be a good idea for you to have a look at some of them and provide your dad with a list of the addresses for those that you feel might be beneficial for all concerned..

I sincerely hope and pray for the sake of your dad AND for you and your family that he snaps back to the reality of the situation he’s in and begins to take measures to rectify the problems he has created for all concerned. I will continue to monitor the posts/replies in your story and although I may not post replies to most of them, I will ‘chime in’ when I think I can offer something that might be of benefit to you.

Dixie Darling (senorita_cd)

[Kay(SO)]

Jennifer,

The part of your post that caught my eye was where you wrote about wanting your dad back the way you used to have him. And how other's are telling you he's the same person.

Well, my take on that is this; he is the same person. Your perspective of him has changed and you now know who he really is. The father you knew really didn't exist. He was simply a fantasy dad since your father was afraid to let you see the real him. Afraid that you would hate him or leave or that exactly what has happened would happen. His nightmare has come true. He's basically lost his family and loved ones. It sounds to me like you need to give yourself time to grief the loss of the man you thought he was so that you might have a chance of accepting someday, the man he is. Is it fair? Absolutely not. Is it crappy? You bet. Is it your new reality? Yes, and not accepting that will mean that you won't have your dad at all. And that would be the biggest shame of all.

As for him pushing the envelope and acting as if everyone around him should just accept it and shut up. Well, he's living on a pink cloud, enjoying his new found sense of self-acceptance. He may not see or comprehend that you need time to sort it all out. The bottom line is, take the time you need. So that eventually you may come back together with him and enjoy a relationship with him.

I hope you'll keep up posted on how things go.

Kay(SO)

[JenniferMu.(GG)]

Hi Kay, thanks for your help, you're spot on with the family thing, I'm feeling a bit low today, it's a day off till this evening and I've never felt so alone in my life but this is my doing and I have to work through it even though I miss my family so much. At least my g/f rang me last night and said Mum had moved back with Dad and that made me a lot happier as he's not good at looking after himself as we've always looked after him and his domestic skills are not what you'd call good. I was worried that he wouldn't feed himself properly and his washing and ironing skills are also lacking.

The reason I first came looking for a place like this is that Gran told me it would be best if I found people like my father and talked with them as there is nothing like first hand information straight from the horses mouth, even if I didn't like what I might hear and it seems like my g/f and I made a good choice when surfing the net and found this place. I thought about seeking out people at home on a face to face thingy but I doubted I could handle that at the stage we were at a while ago. I'm learning a lot but sometimes when people say some things about my father it hurts me some even though I think it's probably the truth in what they're saying, I just can't get my head around some things and I just wish I could.

I'm still trying to figure out how he can still be the same person he always was, maybe you mean to him he is, but to me he isn't and it's like trying to get used to a stranger who I know I should accept but I can't for reasons I've said before. One thing I've learnt from here and I have to try and accept is that I'll never get him back as the person I've grown up to know and love. But I can't be expected to just accept that overnight can I, is that how it's supposed to happen if it's going to be alright with us? Sometimes when I'm a bit low I just want to run to him and hug and squeeze him and tell him how much I love him and that it'll be alright, but then later I know that if I do that now I'm not being sincere and honest with myself and I'll kick myself later for being dishonest. My father brought me up saying over and over that if I feel I'm right about anything then I have to stick to my guns no matter what, but also keep an open mind and listen to all sides and never be afraid to admit I'm wrong and accept being wrong with the same grace I'll accept being right with. What is tearing me up with all this is I really don't know if I'm right, sometimes I think I am and sometimes I think maybe I'm wrong in how I feel and the things I say, sometimes I just wish I was about 6 years old again and all this could pass over my head, it just makes me so mad and angry that this happened to us.

I've been thinking that what Gran says when she's always described Dad and I as an irrestible force meeting an immovable object is not helping as we're so much alike. When he eventaully said that this is my house, bought and paid for by me and he should be able to do what he pleased in it and to get over it as he was going to dress up as he wished, then that made me see red. He makes a bit of a thing about money and that's why I've worked it out that I can save $300 a week working two jobs and it'll only take me 2 years to pay him back the $30,000 he says he paid for my high school education and if it's the last thing I ever do I'm going to drop that money down in front of him and say, " now we;re quits".

It's sad to think that he may have been living his life with that fear inside of him that what's now happened could happen with his wife and family, but isn't that his fault? He can't blame us for what's happened I don't think. If I'd been brought up with him dressing up then I'd probably not think twice about it, just as I've grown up with my gay male friends, I don't ever think about them being weird, they're just my friends I've always known the way they are. Mum says that her greatest fear is not what she now knows about it but what she doesn't know and I feel the same. Is this as far as it goes or is there more, how can we know, he lied all his life to us so why should he be telling all the truth now or do we just take him at face value? I don't know anything anymore or who we're supposed to trust anymore. I was brought up not to tell lies and even though I've told some porkies it's only ever been about things which didn't matter much, nothing ever so big it would hurt my family and they usually finished up getting me into trouble when the truth came out.

I don't hate him but then I don't like him much either but I still love him, that looks and sounds stupid but that's how I feel, I know what I mean even if I can't say it properly. I love him because he's my father and he's a good man but I hate him for how he's hurt my mother and sis. I hope mum and him can work things out now they're back together again but I suppose only time will tell. I know I had to get away and leave them by themselves because of my attitude which probably wasn't helping it all, but I miss my mum so much. My mum is many things to me, one she is my best mate, we always joke and laugh together and sing together and just being with her gives me a warm fuzzy feeling and I miss her so much. I know people will say that it;'s my own fault and I accept some of the blame and it makes me feel guilty I was a coward and run away and he's right ins aying I'm a coward, but only I can know how my head was about to explode and being a coward was what I had to do and I'll live with that.

Darlene, you said that this crap is not easy to go through. Wow, that's putting it mildly and I can't wait for that sun to shine through, but sometimes in a quieter moment I think this may be a payback for having life so good for the first 18 years of my life, but the last 10 months or so have collected my dues big time.

Allen, the doors closed but not locked, I need this time away so one day I can go home. When that'll be I haven't even thought about, it may be a year, two or ten I don't know, but what I'll do when I feel better and think the time is right, I'll let them know where I am and if they still like me enough to come visit me then I'll look forward to that, but my father said to me, you make your own bed so you lie on it and that's what I'm doing, even if it's a bit lumpy.

Beauty, don't hate my dad, he's really a good man and he's done more good in his life than bad and if it's true what you all say about him not being able to help how he is then there is an excuse for him but there's still no excuse for not owning up a long time ago. Mum says she thinks now that if she'd known before we were born or when we were real young she would have maybe been better with it, but now she's scared for me and sis and what it could do to our lives and our friends and she's built up her circle of friends and she can't talk about this with any of them as they usually talks about problems together and she hates living in secrecy with something which has the potential to hurt her whole family with the people we know and where we live. I just wish I could make things right for her but I don't know how I could do that as I can't even make it right for myself yet. I just hope you're right in that he'll slow down with it but it's sort of all got away from him since we found him out, sort of like he was grateful we found him out and it gave him a licence to go for it come what may.

Maybe I didn't handle it right the day sis and Iw alked in on him in Mums dress, but I just freaked out before I knew what was happening. I've gone over and over that day trying to see what I should have done but all I see is us walking into the lounge room and him sitting there. The first thing I saw was Mums dress and I was taken by surprise because I knew she wouldn't be at home at that time and Iw as about to say something smart like, did they sack you, then I heard sis behind me gasp something and it dawned on me what it really was and my eyes locked on his and we stayed that way for what seemed like ages and a million things raced through my mind before he said something and I still don't know what he said, but I just freaked out and run out of the house as I wanted to be sick as I got the cold sweats and couldn't stop shaking, it was such a shock and every time I relive it I feel sick again, I just can't help it, but it's better now than at first. You asked, do I think he's a transexual, well I don't know, he says not but I don't know if he's telling the whole truth of how he feels. Maybe since he's seen what's happened he's backing off a bit and there might be more to come, how can we tell? I don't know anything anymore, it's all happened so fast. He says he doesn't want to be a woman but he's sure going to a lot of trouble at times to look like one and even though he brings it up about all the money we've cost he doesn't spare any expense now on looking like a woman.

So I've prattled on a long time again and it's probably boring to a lot of people and for that I apologise, but I do thank you all for the free therapy and the use of your soap box, it does help to let it out and what you say doesn't miss me, believe me, it's just that my brain feels sore and it can only absorb so much these days in a limited time and I don't want to muck up working through this, even though our family may never be what it once was, we have to try and stick the pieces back together somehow in the future even if they don't fit back exactly where they were once.

J.

[DonnaT]

Jennifer, if you didn't love him you wouldn't agonize over this so much. Instead you'd sit back and let what ever is to happen between your parents happen. So it's clear that although you don't like the CDing side of him, you still love him.

As for paying him back any monies he may have spent raising you, forget it. Sounds too much like spite instead of the love you've professed.

How far will he go or is this it? He may not know, so can only tell you how he feels now. I've seen CD's go further than they ever thought, but most ot them, but not all, have always felt like they should have been born a girl. Some have honestly, as far as they knew at the time, thought it would never happen to them. Most of CDs, however, never transition further, but instead remain CDs, whether closeted or out in the open.

It's sad to think that he may have been living his life with that fear inside of him that what's now happened could happen with his wife and family, but isn't that his fault? He can't blame us for what's happened I don't think.

Note that through evolution, most men have the idea they they have to be the family protector and provider. Doing anything to change that image in front of their family goes against the "masculine" grain. So telling their family they wear women's clothes is about the hardest thing they can do.

There is a fear that their family won't accept them, that their family will no longer see them as the person they once knew. And this is exactly what has happened in some cases, but in other cases there is understanding and acceptance. Its a hit or miss situation for just about every CD.

In your father's case, his greatest fear has come true. There is no guarantee that if he had raised you with the knowledge that he was a CD, things would have been easier. For all you know, your mother could have left him, being at a younger age and all. Then you would not have known your father as you knew him before this incident. Your mother could have remarried and moved clear across the continent. She could have left him and married a more 'macho' man, one not so nice as your father.

There are a lot of what ifs.

Your father sees himself as being no different than before, where you see him in a different light. What is it you see?

I tell my wife I am the same person I always was. That my female side has made me the person I am. Her knowing that I am a CD does not change who I am. I can still do everything I could do, as a man, before she was told. There is nothing I cannot do that I used to be able to do, just because I crossdress. So, have I changed or am I the same as I always have been? I think it is safe to say that I have not changed.

So, what is it that your father can no longer do just because he "needs" to dress enfemme?

If I'd been brought up with him dressing up then I'd probably not think twice about it, just as I've grown up with my gay male friends, I don't ever think about them being weird, they're just my friends I've always known the way they are.

If you think you could have handled it at a younger age, shouldn't you be able to handle it now, now that you are older, wiser and more informed? Now that you know that he was born transgendered? That it is a genetic thing that occured while he was still a fetus?

I'm learning a lot but sometimes when people say some things about my father it hurts me some even though I think it's probably the truth in what they're saying, I just can't get my head around some things and I just wish I could.

Just what are they saying?

[Loretta Ann]

Darlene, you said that this crap is not easy to go through. Wow, that's putting it mildly

I know it is Jennifer. If this was not the kind of place it is I would have used much stronger words than I did. I hate the actions that bring these kinds of things about with a passion. There is no way that you can realize just how much I long to reach out to you and give the biggest longest hug that you would allow me to give you.

You will need to be able to separate the things that I have said to you and will say to you. I am condemning actions not the person responsible for the actions. I understand where your father is at and most of the reasons for his behavior and would try to support him if he were to come here. But it is you who have come here so it is you who I will support. You need to understand that I am not condemning ether of you. But I will challenge things you have written where I believe you may be headed for more danger.

Jennifer I fear for you over your repeated statements that you want to pay your father back for the money he spent on your schooling. Although I can understand your feelings and why you would like to do this, it will not bring about the results you desire. You will end up one sorry discouraged little lady, and you will have wasted two years of your life.

What needs to be challenged here are the reasons (with in you) that lead you to believe that this action will be beneficial. Presently that is one of your enemies, and that needs to be dealt with.

The best I can do for you is to try and point you in the right direction. You will have to do the work. But you know what? You will do it as long as you are aware of what needs to be worked on. For me that was half of the problem, finding out what needed changing. And that can take some people years.

Also Jennifer you have a lot of information here to digest the best you will be able to do for now is to retain it as head knowledge. It will take time but eventually some of it will become heart knowledge. And when that happens it will be yours.

Love Darlene.

[Beauty]

. . .

Beauty, don't hate my dad, he's really a good man and he's done more good in his life than bad and if it's true what you all say about him not being able to help how he is then there is an excuse for him but there's still no excuse for not owning up a long time ago. . .

Maybe I didn't handle it right the day sis and Iw alked in on him in Mums dress, but I just freaked out before I knew what was happening. . .

So I've prattled on a long time again and it's probably boring to a lot of people and for that I apologise, but I do thank you all for the free therapy and the use of your soap box, it does help to let it out and what you say doesn't miss me, believe me, it's just that my brain feels sore and it can only absorb so much these days in a limited time and I don't want to muck up working through this, even though our family may never be what it once was, we have to try and stick the pieces back together somehow in the future even if they don't fit back exactly where they were once.

J.

Hey there Jennifer. I didn't say I hated him. I said the opposite.

Ok, back to 4th gear now. Let me just tell you one other thing about my feelings about your dad. I've beaten the heck out of how p'd I am about him blaming you and for keeping the secret for so long, but I can empathize with how he did it. I don't dislike him. I don't hate him. I feel bad for him, but not as bad as I feel for you because you didn't have a choice. I caught myself from digressing. I have an uber close friend who did the same thing your dad did (didn't tell anyone) and she's now divorced and her kids are pretty upset, but much less than before. She also now will dress in a way that makes her children feel comfy instead of imposing her will upon them. That wasn't always the case either. I love and respect her so much as my friend and I patiently waited as she went through changes that I had also gone through. I would be a huge hypocrite about this if I told you I dislike your father when I understand why and what my friend went through. . . Anyway, my heart honestly goes out to your father, but you, your mom, and your sister come first because I've gotten to know you better. That doesn't change the fact that I feel for him. I wish he'd talk to someone, but like you, he's a bit strong in the mind and for now he's doing self therapy. . . I think you knew already I did not dislike him, but I decided to chime in, in case I was very wrong.

I can understand how you misread it. The fact that you did is a GREAT sign. It means you're starting to forgive. Look how perfectly defensive you were. It was great! It shows you're love for him is as strong as ever and you're just starting to learn to cope.

You're going to be fine. Things are looking up for sure because you're moving into the coping stage or acceptance. The anger is beginning to subside. I'm glad your mom moved back in. That's another good sign.

Like a baby who fights sleep (and no I'm not calling you a baby) it seems like your shock, being upset, being put off, being angry is starting to subside and the one thing that drives us all is starting to take over again. Love. The love is what I'm calling sleep. Love is starting to overtake you. Let it.

You handled it the only way you knew how. Maybe I could have said how I didn't hate your father in a better way?

Don't beat yourself up over stuff you can't control anymore. You and I know you can't control the past.

Lastly, you're not boring at all. As you can see we all love and care about you bunches. You did a good thing coming here. It was good for you and your family.

Beauty

[Loretta Ann]

Jennifer,

Upon rereading your post there is something else I would to comment on

I'm still trying to figure out how he can still be the same person he always was, maybe you mean to him he is,
Jennifer he is still the same person he always was he just didn’t let you know who he was.
but to me he isn't and it's like trying to get used to a stranger
Yes he is a stranger due the fact that he hid apart of who he is from you
who I know I should accept but I can't for reasons I've said before. One thing I've learnt from here and I have to try and accept is that I'll never get him back as the person I've grown up to know and love. But I can't be expected to just accept that overnight can I,
No you certainly can not be expected to do it over night, it will take some time. Take all the time you need, don’t rush yourself.
is that how it's supposed to happen if it's going to be alright with us? Sometimes when I'm a bit low I just want to run to him and hug and squeeze him and tell him how much I love him and that it'll be alright, but then later I know that if I do that now I'm not being sincere and honest with myself and I'll kick myself later for being dishonest. My father brought me up saying over and over that if I feel I'm right about anything then I have to stick to my guns no matter what, but also keep an open mind and listen to all sides and never be afraid to admit I'm wrong and accept being wrong with the same grace I'll accept being right with.
That is good advice
What is tearing me up with all this is I really don't know if I'm right, sometimes I think I am and sometimes I think maybe I'm wrong in how I feel and the things I say,
One thing that is very important to understand. Is that you will need to true to yourself. All that we have told you here is information. You will need to do what you feel is right in your heart. It may not be the right way but if you proceed (cautiously) with your eyes open you will find out where and when you might need to make some adjustments along the way.

There is no template that fits every situation perfectly; we all need to find our own way. The more information one has amounts to more resources to help you find your way. That is how it is supposed to work.

Love Darlene.